3. For the moron Neanderthals of the Far Right who will scream its the operators fault and we do not give a shit about marketing more safer designed weapons, if such idiotic polices were followed for other consumer goods today we would not have safety glass, anti-lock breaks, back up safeties, child proof medicine caps and chemical bottles, back up cameras, kick back muzzles on chain saws and the list goes on and on. Being highly trained doesnt eliminate stupidity. But breaking news here, skippy. never got into the P320 It is to me a Range gun not a carry gun. CBC News reached out to Sig Sauer and its Canadian distributor, M.D. Inside the gun, a metal piece called the sear should keep the weapon from firing until the trigger is pulled. Would you? But I hope Sig fights it until the bitterest of ends. He wanted TTAG to convey that hes pro-Second Amendment. Bagnell is representing a number of the police officers who have filed suits against SIG for un-commanded discharges, but wouldnt disclose the exact number. The same should hold true for the insane marketing of pistols like the totally unsafe Glock. This is just blind greed using some careless doofus to sell a lie and cash in because a civil jury, like the average American voter, can be manipulated easily though emotion, tears and stories of anguish, pain and suffering at the foot of some super-rich evil corporations cold-blooded behest. PDs are dropping them from contracts. He had to be reprimanded by the range officer twice for unsafe handling of his pistol. They have similar vertical sear engagement, but the M&P has more engagement width wise. We will respect the ongoing investigation and will not offer further comment at this time, Bineau said. On Nov. 5, 2020, a recently-purchased SIG Sauer P320 pistol went off unexpectedly at a training range in Dwyer Hill, outside of Ottawa. Over the top, hammy and with incredible choleric energy, but as he once said, when you trying to seriously sell a scene that has space ship with obvious carboard walls, christmas lights and a guy in a rubber gorilla suit with a plastic horn on its head, if you play it lowkey youre dead the audience is gonna focus on how cheesy it all is. Bineau added the review is looking at so-called ancillary equipment (meaning the holster and other items) as one element of that broader investigation. Have heard of no issues like the alleged gremlin caused spontaneous discharges of the P320 in other Sig models. I call b-s on all these my gun magically went off. That said, I own multiple P320s, but all of them have the manual safety due to personal preference. Hey, Im glad theres somethings we agree on! That took a lot. Sig P320 discharge while holstered. Trust a P365 with your life. Im reading about a moron who wraps a loaded firearm in a cloth and stuff it in a gym bag, and other dumb behavior that tells me the weapon isnt the problem but the user. These cops seem pretty dang stupid if they put loaded guns in gym bags and purses with other stuff and carry them around, especially a gun that lacks manual safeties. My elderly aunt drove her Volvo into a parked car, and the yard behind it, and the house behind that, while she was pressing the brake as hard as she could. Strangely the car kept accelerating, almost as if she were flooring the gas pedal. Sound familiar? I have almost a hatred for Glocks but the one thing that they are is reliable. Thats the American system at work in all its corrupt majesty. So I think it is unconscionable, given the number of incidents of this gun defectively discharging without a trigger pull, would necessitate that someone order it to be recalled and only SIG can do that.. SIG doesnt so you get killed by a punk with a Hi Point. three changes to the original design. The Milwaukee police department has had 3 incidents of the Sig discharging while being in a holster sitting in a patrol car in 2023. The best take on this subject is by the author himself: this is about slime lawyers looking to build a national narrative and get a few wins in, so they can more easily get the next win and the next one, the next one and so on. If it were a lowered tier manufacturer like a Taurus having allegations made against them, people would run with it without thinking twice. I dunno if its a case of lowest bidders blues or what. So it never had a history of a potential valid claim for ambulance chasers to work off of. In 1982 the G17 hit the market and in 1983 they gave 30,000 pistols to the Austrian military at cost. Hilton's $15 million lawsuit said, "there have been 54 reported uncommanded discharges of the P320," meaning the gun went off by itself, over the last five years in 22 states and Washington, D.C. This gun had been voluntary upgraded. So your fanboy perjorative falls not only flat but false. Third, Glock has had problems, too. Or you would have to have enough slide play for the slide movement to physically disengage the sear and striker leg mating surfaces. But were way past the days of major league, internationally known gunmakers turning out complete crap, selling it and the public living with it. The thing is, youd probably need to generate many Gs of force in both directions simultaneously. While this incident occurred months ago, this erroneous media report is driven by multiple sources, including our competitors, and coincides with the imminent release of other Canadian military and law enforcement tenders, indicating the timing of its release is an attempt to improperly influence the procurements, the statement said. These lawsuits arent about Sig making a defective weapon, theyre about lawyers building a nationwide consensus in civil trial that makes it easier (and more lucrative) to soak gunmakers. In 2020, the agent, who is a former marine, was doing his routine training with the P320. Anyway around here they do. They both underwent full testing but while the Sig was the cheaper handgun ($1.50), it also quoted higher costs for magazines and spare parts, boosting the overall cost of the acquisition. Sig Sauer's headquarters are located in New Hampshire at Pease International Tradeport. Too much MIM in that crap SIG, the old ones were great. It was one of the first ones and was sent back as a voluntary upgrade. BTW it was HK that made the first polymer gun, Glock actually stole the idea for the G17 from them. The sear cams it back a teeny bit. And yes, if I pulled some of those stunts, Id have my membership revoked. I would trust the intelligence of a Gorilla in a zoo before any one in the Far Right. This is what happens when you go with the lowest bidder. Either the gun is defective or its not. The P320 pistol is a dog. He points to it in the video. abprototype.com can add the manual safety as well as add the notches in the grip frame. They've also been adopted as duty guns by law enforcement agencies across the country. The claim basically boils down to the notion that in normal, unconcerning operation, a foreign body entered the striker body. Manual safeties on pistols, hammer and striker fired systems were found necessary as far back as 1900. The trigger bar has to push up on it, for it to release. Seems kind of like a Sig apologist article. While we dont have the actual numbers of similar lawsuits filed against other gun makers actually no one individual or organization seems to keep track of these things and gun makers dont want to talk about it it seems highly likely that every major firearm manufacturer gets its share of a regular flow of lawsuits filed by both civilians and LEOs who claim SHAZAM! It upgraded its P320 pistols in October 2018, before the middle school incident, spokeswoman Amanda. I was tempted to buy one at one time but no more. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. Even if it was an issue with the sear interface, there is still a firing pin safety that will not move unless the trigger is held firmly to the rear. 2. (a) A person commits an offense if the person recklessly discharges a firearm inside the corporate limits of a municipality having a population of 100,000 or more. Upgrades are for things that didnt work right in the first place. The SIG P320, which has been manufactured since 2014, is known to go off without the trigger being pulled if it's dropped and lands on the ground at a certain angle. You arent a gunfighter, either. Yes, conspiracy to defraud is a thing when ones @ss is on the line. First, clearing a loaded firearm with a finger over the muzzle doesnt exhibit even cursory adherence to the Four Rules. The military is much smarter and no, the gun is not junk. Profits over reliability and you end up with junk. Its pathetic how often these legal stunts work. The Collette suit, for example, lists 39 such discharges, all but five of which involved law enforcement officers. I have no idea. 1) The p320 doesnt hold the striker fully to the rear. Ron, Excellent work. Just 3 days ago, a Florida Corrections recruit killed herself by a negligent discharge during firearms training. The company didnt want to comment on any specific pending litigation for obvious reasons. Hello perpetrators, Lee Paige is clearly the gift that keeps on giving though our buddy Hunter Biden is a close second! Sometimes you dont get what you pay for but now SIG has bragging rights. The truth is the absolute WORST semi-autos that Sig, H&K, Walther, Beretta or Glock makes today are more reliable than the best semi-autos made 40 years ago, by far. He wanted to see how accurate the gun was, especially after the customer got it back after the voluntary upgrade. Maybe in South America a poor military did, but thatd be about it. The new guy sucks. . Contacted late Friday, a spokeswoman for special forces said the investigation is still ongoing and would not confirm the companys findings. Theyre cheering for a noose around their own precious Glocks throat. And they would not have done that for no reason at all. Withe the P320 Sigs contract was $169.5 million, $103 million cheaper then Glock. Anyway my question for $600 would be: Did you have your 3rd wife killed? Quite frankly, a sizable number of the LEOs that go there, would benefit from a Gun Safety 101 class. It sure wasnt her fault though, because she was flooring the. Cars have so many electronics these days, who knows what could have gone wrong! The fact is that the plaintiffs will get paid regardless of who did what. 19 Feb 2021 Military.com | By Matthew Cox A former U.S. Marine and federal agent has filed a $10 million lawsuit against Sig Sauer Inc. alleging that his holstered Sig P320 -- a pistol. It takes time for any new platform to work the kinks out. You clanging a bell that went silent years ago. I bought a P320 and went through the voluntary upgrade. Is there any major military anywhere that ever issued one of their guns? Glocks biggest problem is they havent innovated since 1985. Attorney Bagnell held up the law enforcement officers he represents as examples of people who are highly trained in carrying and using firearms. I lost $200 on a gun that had less then 1000 rounds through it but I could care. The one officer in the ABC story had it wrapped in a rag in his gym bag? Sig, take this firearm off the market, and recall. Thats deflecting from the real issue. Seems a bit apologetic to me. DND/CAF is not in a position at this stage in its investigation to offer insight into the potential causes because our investigation scope is broader than the technical aspect pertaining to the unintended discharge of the pistol.. The clearest memory I have about the many people experiencing post-upgrade discharges is a cop who set his P320 on a table, and several seconds after letting go, IT DISCHARGED ON ITS OWN! The Glocks lack of a manual safety has caused untold thousands of needless cripplings and death. The incident with the P320 - a contender for a major Canadian Armed Forces procurement of thousands of pistols and holsters that has a Aug. 3 deadline for industry proposals - occurred at JTF-2's Dwyer Hill training range just west of Ottawa. He said hes a gun owner and a concealed carry permit holder. Period. Have you ever put a handgun down with your palm in front of the muzzle? Theres also an un-named Texas gun shop manager who says a P320 fired as he cleared the weapon, blowing off one of his fingers. He said there has to be something wrong with the gun if this is happening to individuals with this amount of training, this amount of skill.. While it seems that I have a preference for battle ships, The Romulans had Warbirds. His haste to avoid the embarrassment of his gun being seen on the floor turned the incident from a wardrobe malfunction (accidental exposure of a concealed weapon, probably just a reprimand from the OPR) into a negligent discharge (the gun being fired led to him personally getting fired!). What exactly did Harrison mean by legal momentum? That isnt clear, but its easy to make an educated guess. (b) An offense under this section is a Class A misdemeanor. Post again when you buy a real gun that you can defend yourself with. You have entered an incorrect email address! NEWINGTON - A Hillsboro man is suing Newington gunmaker Sig Sauer alleging his Sig P320 pistol fired, without him pulling the trigger, causing a bullet to be discharged into his thigh. The investigation revealed the use of an incorrect holster not designed for a [SIG] P320, said the statement, which was released Friday and posted to a U.S. online pro-industry publication, Soldier Systems. Second, every gun maker has made lemons in the past. Wow new finger grooves, crazy innovation. Its hard to say yet but with anything follow the basic safety rules. Guess it hasnt dawned on them that: 1. Note that Harrisons comment about these claims possibly being the result of legal momentum were edited out of the longer Nightline version of the report. https://millsentertainment.smugmug.com/William-Shatner-The-Wrath-of-Khan No picture for me. They simply have never been seen in the upper echelon of handgun makers, their entire business model is to offer cheaper guns at cheaper prices. A plastic gun that has a tendency to go off by itself. Fact is most SF carry what they want and the Marine Recon I know very well who has friends in that community told me many in the Navy NSW program still carry the Mk 25, they don want a striker fired pistol that can hydrolock in water. To put it simply, they are expensive cheaply made junk. They habitually use their customers as the product testers by selling what are essentially prototypes while quietly implementing rolling revisions. to docile, too subtle, to contextual. As to prong 2, there is a considerable difference between the mechanism of a 320 and, say, ones basic Glock, in that a 320 is fully cocked, whereas a Glock is half-cocked until the trigger is fully depressed, with the striker remaining locked by the striker safety plunger until that is released by a cam on the trigger bar. Hes talking about trial lawyers recruiting clients whove experienced negligent discharges with P320s and suing the gun manufacturer. Keep the phrase legal momentum in mind. Trying to categorically say Brand X is better than Brand Y! Everyone remember the video of the DEA agent shooting himself while explaining that he was highly qualified to carry a gun? Covid ruined that gravy train for him but hes still doing the conventions. Glocks have gone off when people attempted to holster them and after they have holstered them, some times way later after holstering them like the fellow that got into his pickup truck. You would have to conclude theres a problem with the product, not with the people., In the Nightline version, Bagnell says, Firearms are not subject to federal regulation. Why you and I are arguing over a gun that neither owns or will own, I dont own a Glock or a SIG and am not a fanboy of either. 3. Depending on who you talk to you will get many different answers. With the 320, the striker is in full-cock position, and held there through the operation of the trigger sear and the positive striker-blocking safety. On February 19, 2021, Military.com reported: A former U.S. Marine and federal agent has filed a $10 million lawsuit against Sig Sauer Inc. alleging that his holstered Sig P320 a pistol that the Army's new sidearm is based on accidentally discharged, firing a 9mm bullet into his right leg. This reminds me of when Gretchen Carlson sued Fox News for sexual harassment and she got 20 million dollars. Sig can burn for all I care. Liberal, Conservative. To be sure, Ive informally asked every other owner of a Serpa holster when I meet them, whether they have ever had an ND because of the holster. A fine of up to $10,000. The fact that Shatner was doing Wrath of Kahn meet and greets at 90 years old kind of soured me. The moral of all of this is the reason Sig got the military contract was because they were selling guns at close to cost, they underbid Glock by a significant margin. Was it his fault? This leads me to conclude that the problem is not the gear but the moron using it. Ive seen similar situations at our Municipal range. The second accidental shooting happened after police supervisors internally raised questions about the safety of the SIG Sauer P320. Clients such as law enforcement officers whose negligent discharges could result in their being disciplined or fired unless it can be proven that the gun was at fault. And thats just my opinion. The problem is non-existent. I mean hey, yelling about firearms preferences online is no more productive than discussing nerdy Star Trek stuff, is it? Back in 2017, SIG instituted a voluntary upgrade program to replace the original production triggers with new enhanced triggers designed to fix the issue that we and others observed when the pistols were dropped onto hard surfaces. The cost of settlements will be passed on to us. The modular SIG P320 is among the most widely-owned handguns on the planet. He would have been booted after the first time, but being a cop comes with some special privileges. They suck and Im awesome!, 2. The probable reason that some folks are saying that the P320 is unsafe is that there was a lawsuit filed in federal court in July of 2020 (Guay v. Sig Sauer) alleging that the 320 fired "un-commanded" without a trigger pull while in a holster.
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